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  Post #31 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
Here is my challenge to everyone: I CHALLENGE anyone of you by any how to get to the top of the list by paying money to ReviewsGurus.com or change the GuruScore for a fee.

And even if you tried to spam our system, we have ways to detect that.
Nabil, I think you misunderstood what he said. He said that any company, if they have the cash to burn, can purchase a position on Top 10 sites, or run one itself.
 
 
 


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  Post #32 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artashes View Post
How can you claim HostJury and ReviewsGurus to be anywhere close to being trustworthy? How can you state that you stand by the user side when neither HJ nor your website does any kind of verification of reviews? Where is the authenticity of those reviews? Any company can send an army of their clients (or paid writers) to these sites and get positive reviews listed tomorrow, which completely discredits the score system. An "expert review" is nothing more than a summary and carries no value to me as a potential client. A sign up process in general is very much the same with every company, so what kind of long-term experience can you really take from it?

So I am not sure how you can claim that "we test each product thoroughly and give high marks to only the very best". Can you share with is what this testing process consists of? Apart, of course, from opening an account when the company is aware of it.

Let's look at this one in particular:
http://hosting.reviewsgurus.com/revi...round-120.aspx

How did you test their reliability and update? What software did you use? Can you provide the logs for that? How long did you have an active account for?

How many questions did you ask them? What kind of questions? Did you save the screenshots of those tickets that you can share with us to see what response times were and how they were answered?

What I, as a consumer, want to know is not how you paid for an account (with a credit card or by PayPal), but whether you had any issues with getting a refund according to their money-back guarantee policy and how long did it take them to process it. For that, of course, you should have sign up anonymously with a company (without letting them know) with your real credit card and then seek a money-back for any kind of technical issue you've experienced, or just a full refund if it was within their 15-30 day money back period.

I just went ahead and posted two fake reviews on random companies to HostJury and ReviewsGurus. Both reviews were posted instantly, no questions asked. At least HostJury tries to claim they "verify URLs" (which they don't because I didn't specify a correct one). ReviewsGurus doesn't do anything at all.

So with all due respect, named websites are nothing more than a part of the overall "top 10 list" noise, driven by affiliate programs.
Artashes, first let me thank you for providing your honest frank feedback about our platform, this is great opportunity for us to get to know users expectations.

I agree with you that currently we don't have a strong process of verifying user reviews; however, here is what we're working on:
  • We are developing a strict process to verify user reviews. And to prove that here is the beta unannounced url: http://beta.reviewsgurus.com/add-review.aspx?cid=120 and just updated the live site with it: http://hosting.reviewsgurus.com/web-...g-reviews.aspx
  • in the meanwhile we are working hard in the background to fight spammers and track companies whose submitting reviews about themselves - trust me this is easy to figure out and we had several incidents like that from m6.net, HostSEO, and few others. We delete those reviews right way and warn the host.

To me all the points you're referring to are related to missing information or features in our platform, if there are spammers out there that doesn't mean ReviewsGurus.com is not honest or biased - even Google is leading a BIG war with spammers on daily basis.

I wonder if you noticed BIG companies on RG with bad GuruScore and HIGH affiliate payout? Here are few of many:
And so many others, why? Because of users' feedback and our expert reviews. We tested iPage and we talked to more than 12 former and current iPage customers and come up with the Expert Review that you can see on the page.

Again, here is my challenge to you and to all:
  • Try to change the GuruScore (which controls the position in the list) by offering money to ReviewsGurus.com in any way you want or anytime - you will NOT be able to. Lots of providers tried and that's why we added the sponsored listing which does NOT change the Score and marks the host as sponsored with different color.
  • We will implement Any suggestion from you guys that you feel necessary to make the site up to your expectations for trustworthiness - ANYTHING!

We are building a platform and a community to change the hosting reviews spammy monkey business and your doubts are understood as it's really very hard to believe there a legitimate honest reviews site these days. But keep an eye on us ... time will proof to you all that we are really honest!

Thanks again for this great discussion

Nabil
 
 
 


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  Post #33 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artashes View Post
Nabil, I think you misunderstood what he said. He said that any company, if they have the cash to burn, can purchase a position on Top 10 sites, or run one itself.
Thats exactly what i meant. i added our site to one of these so called review sites and was then within 24 hours emailed by the site owners stating i can be listed in the top 10 if i paid. the more i paid the higher i would be.
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  Post #34 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 01:01 PM
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Nabil, I appreciate your desire to build an honest review system and the discussion that we are having. But:

Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
I agree with you that currently we don't have a strong process of verifying user reviews;
You don't have any process of verifying user reviews - that would be the correct way to put it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
however, here is what we're working on:
  • We are developing a strict process to verify user reviews. And to prove that here is the beta unannounced url: http://beta.reviewsgurus.com/add-review.aspx?cid=120 and just updated the live site with it: http://hosting.reviewsgurus.com/web-...g-reviews.aspx
  • in the meanwhile we are working hard in the background to fight spammers and track companies whose submitting reviews about themselves - trust me this is easy to figure out and we had several incidents like that from m6.net, HostSEO, and few others. We delete those reviews right way and warn the host.
Your beta review system still doesn't offer anything in the review system that would bring validity to any reviews left.

Spammers have little to do with anything and while they are easier to stop, if someone puts their mind to it, they would still squeeze some reviews in if necessary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
I wonder if you noticed BIG companies on RG with bad GuruScore and HIGH affiliate payout? Here are few of many:
And so many others, why? Because of users' feedback and our expert reviews. We tested iPage and we talked to more than 12 former and current iPage customers and come up with the Expert Review that you can see on the page.
You said it yourself that you do not have a way to verify user reviews right now. Consequently, the score ratings are not indicative of provider's performance as data that feeds the system is flawed.

I've been brainstorming about the subject of an accurate review system for many years. Unfortunately, I just have to tell you that there is not an easy and an affordable way out there to bring validity into the review system. No matter what you do, no matter how much money you spend, there will always be a point of subjectivity. The science of "testing" anything is very precise and unless you approach it in a scientific and a quantitative way (which will always be limited by factors that can be measured anyway), you can never come to a true objective review.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
Again, here is my challenge to you and to all:
  • Try to change the GuruScore (which controls the position in the list) by offering money to ReviewsGurus.com in any way you want or anytime - you will NOT be able to. Lots of providers tried and that's why we added the sponsored listing which does NOT change the Score and marks the host as sponsored with different color.
Can't comment on this one just because it is a silly challenge.

In fact, I have another challenge for anyone here on HostingDiscussion to tell me that I am incorrect in my assessment of a typical web hosting review site such as the one Nabil runs, or any other. Prove to me that a site like that is a credible review source.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
your doubts are understood as it's really very hard to believe there a legitimate honest reviews site these days. But keep an eye on us ... time will proof to you all that we are really honest!
In the meantime, my fake review is still online.

Good discussion, Nabil.
 
 
 


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  Post #35 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 02:56 PM
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Haven't reached a high level of accuracy yet but at least someone honest is trying, which makes ReviewsGurus one of the most accurate and
honest sites out there

Good talk

P.S. Your fake review never affected the GuruScore and now is deleted
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  Post #36 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nabeez View Post
which makes ReviewsGurus one of the most accurate and honest sites out there
This is a FAKE reveiw/comment as you cant say that really as ReviewsGurus is your own site so how do you know that it is an accurate and honest site when you do not validate reviews placed on your site.
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  Post #37 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 08:36 PM
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I look at this site and try to find what is different when it comes to the reviews. Your top 5 matches or closely matches most revenue driven hosting review sites

Site Ground - $80-$150/signup depending on amount of sign ups per month
BlueHost - $90
HostPapa - Up to $200
Eleven2 - $50-$150
HostGator - $100/sale

I guess I would definitely feel better if your top 5 was different from others I see online.

In my opinion (and a lot of others), BlueHost, Host Papa and Eleven2 fall way short of HawkHost, KnownHost, MDD Hosting and a lot of the other less known, but better quality hosting companies. You know the hosting companies that know there is no such thing as unlimited hosting or knows you can,t pay $100 commission on $119/yr hosting account and run a successful business unless your slamming 700 or more accounts on a server and skimming from the affiliate approvals.
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  Post #38 (permalink)   10-05-2012, 08:48 PM
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That is one thing that burns my hide. All these sites are nothing more than one HUGE FTC violation.
They offer reviews and offer coupons, but they are only offering reviews that make a visible page to the public to those companies that are lining their pockets.

This kind of behavior is unethical. They don’t expose the fact nowhere on their site that they are getting huge one time upfront payments for displaying a link to the company that results in a sale.

The smaller companies should enter into a class action lawsuit against the larger companies doing this kind of behavior and sue them for unfair trade practices.

Some people might think this is ridiculous, but I am sure if you asked Microsoft how ridiculous it is they would say different that it is doable and works.
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  Post #39 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 04:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supernix View Post
.
The smaller companies should enter into a class action lawsuit against the larger companies doing this kind of behavior and sue them for unfair trade practices.
you would get nowhere with this as yes its unethical, but not illegal as all they are doing is paying a service provider (site owner) to place an advert/link on their site.
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  Post #40 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 08:36 AM
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I don't know about any other country. I do however know that in the USA a company must abide by Federal Trade Commission rules.

Here is a nice article about it:
http://businesscoaching.typepad.com/...timonials.html

It refers to Bloggers, but it applies to anyone creating content.

The FTC did this due to so many companies hiring people to say good things about them. Many actors were getting on TV and endorsing products saying whatever the advertiser told them. This caused people to make bad investments in money making schemes because of faulty information provided by TV ads and fake testimonials.

Again this is all based on USA laws, so not sure what it would be like if you were in the UK or some other country.

I know they haven't done much of nothing to shut down the nigerians.
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  Post #41 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by supernix View Post
I don't know about any other country. I do however know that in the USA a company must abide by Federal Trade Commission rules.

Here is a nice article about it:
http://businesscoaching.typepad.com/...timonials.html

It refers to Bloggers, but it applies to anyone creating content.

The FTC did this due to so many companies hiring people to say good things about them. Many actors were getting on TV and endorsing products saying whatever the advertiser told them. This caused people to make bad investments in money making schemes because of faulty information provided by TV ads and fake testimonials.

Again this is all based on USA laws, so not sure what it would be like if you were in the UK or some other country.

I know they haven't done much of nothing to shut down the nigerians.
In the Uk we have advertising laws, but these top 10 sites dont break any as its usually 10 ten hosts on that particular site, which the site owner sell the spots which is not illegal.
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  Post #42 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 01:57 PM
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I guess the best way to fight that then is to get all the smaller hosts together and pitch in and put together a super site with top notch SEO efforts to expose them.

PaymeIwillsayanything.com LOL that would be a good one.
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  Post #43 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 02:03 PM
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supernix, I understand what you are saying, but the fact of the matter is - any company out there can start an affiliate program paying $100 in commission per sale. The bigger the commission, the higher the motivation of website owners to expose those companies.

Having said that, there are definitely hundreds of other smaller operators that are excellent hosting providers deserving the attention. While they can add themselves to these review directors, they are not getting the deserved attention due to low or no commission offered. You can start a new brand tomorrow and the day after be listed as #1 hosting provider across hundreds of directories if you give out $250 per sale. It is all a matter of how much cash you are ready to burn to establish yourself on the market.
 
 
 


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  Post #44 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 02:07 PM
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I guess the best way to fight that then is to get all the smaller hosts together and pitch in and put together a super site with top notch SEO efforts to expose them.
how many would you fight then. they are doing nothing ILLEGAL to expose.

ie. a host sees a top ten website (a fancy name for advertising link site) and they pay the site $$$$ to have their site listed with a backlink to their own site and the more advertising fee they pat the higher up in the list they are placed.

this is the same method all the online comparison sites use, so should we all expose these ( wait most have been exposed in the way they run) but still they get thousands using them daily.
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  Post #45 (permalink)   10-06-2012, 03:49 PM
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how many would you fight then. they are doing nothing ILLEGAL to expose.

ie. a host sees a top ten website (a fancy name for advertising link site) and they pay the site $$$$ to have their site listed with a backlink to their own site and the more advertising fee they pat the higher up in the list they are placed.

this is the same method all the online comparison sites use, so should we all expose these ( wait most have been exposed in the way they run) but still they get thousands using them daily.
You obviously didn't read the article.
The FTC has made it clear that you must disclose your relationship with the company you endorse.

Sites like www.webhostingstuff.com don't tell people "hey this is my top ten list and that is because they are the top ten that pay me the most." so it leaves the person believing that they got there through legitimate means.

While it is not illegal to do something that doesn't however make it ethical and proper behavior.

Just like those unlimited everything for a small fee hosts. Sure it is legal and yet not very ethical because they never truly mean what they say.

I guess that is just my major malfunction since I do worry about being an ethical and legal business owner. I don't indulge in hype and outlandish statements to make a sale.

Matter of fact as funny as it is in my business and marketing classes we discussed ethical behavior and honest business. We didn't however discuss how to deal with all these marketers lying their heads off to make a sell.
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