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  Post #1 (permalink)   06-17-2015, 02:41 PM
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With the crackdown on the "unlimited" mobile data marketing gimmicks underway, I wonder how long the "unlimited" marketing gimmick in webhosting is also cracked down on

http://recode.net/2015/01/28/ftc-say...-as-unlimited/
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  Post #2 (permalink)   06-17-2015, 08:10 PM
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Unlimited is still allowed for mobile carriers as long as they don't throttle your connection speed. I have Sprint and I've never been throttled on my unlimited plan.

I honestly don't see the term, "unlimited," going away as it's related to webhosting.
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  Post #3 (permalink)   07-29-2015, 03:35 PM
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They can always change the name to "unmetered" like the misleading and/or shadier hosts do

Last edited by Collabora : 07-29-2015 at 03:38 PM.
 
 
 


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  Post #4 (permalink)   07-30-2015, 01:33 PM
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This is really different. They're actually being throttled, an unlimited host shouldn't (and wouldn't) limit/throttle you as long as you're following the terms you agreed to when signing up. A common example, not using it to store backups.

I've said it before and will again, in this day and age disk space and bandwidth is not relevant.
 
 
 


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  Post #5 (permalink)   07-30-2015, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex - Arvixe View Post
This is really different. .
You have to remember that most of the hosts here don't know the difference between used disk space and allocated disk space, or the difference between human imposed limits and physcially imposed limits. Is it no wonder that they don't know the difference between throttling and allocating?
 
 
 


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  Post #6 (permalink)   08-06-2015, 09:28 PM
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Some hosts will always offer unlimited space.

One way or another, there is always a limit to the amount of space/bandwidth you can use. Therefore it is never actually unlimited!
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  Post #7 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDOServers View Post
Some hosts will always offer unlimited space.

One way or another, there is always a limit to the amount of space/bandwidth you can use. Therefore it is never actually unlimited!
First, the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited. You can have unlimited disk space just as easily on a 4 GB thumb drive as on a 40 TB NAS

Similarly in a calling plan, it refers the number of minutes of call time that is allocated; not the actual number of minutes in a day or month. Thus if by some act of the UN the calendar was changed and number of minutes in a month changed, you can still call the plan unlimited minutes

Second, the subject of the court case was network throttling, not the actual offering of an unlimited plan. In his zeal to bash his competition, the OP got it wrong.

Somewhere I posted some pics of Windows and Linux screen shots showing unlimited disk space as defined and labeled by the OS (not by me or a host). Maybe I should repost them.....
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Last edited by Collabora : 08-07-2015 at 08:06 AM.
 
 
 


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  Post #8 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collabora View Post
You can have unlimited disk space just as easily on a 4 GB thumb drive as on a 40 TB NAS

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so explain how i can get 1000+ GB on on 4GB thumb drive?

it is LIMITED to 4GB, you cant get any more than 4GB
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  Post #9 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 08:40 AM
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Originally Posted by easyhostmedia View Post
so explain how i can get 1000+ GB on on 4GB thumb drive?

it is LIMITED to 4GB, you cant get any more than 4GB
Read my post above (and a computer book). Its explained there. Maybe that's why you didn't quote the sentence above the one you did -- you don't want people to see it and how silly you are being

Disk space in a hosting plan refers to the quota configured by the provider (via control panel or native tools) in the OS, not the size of a physical drive. You really need to get outside your control panel and look at the OS
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Last edited by Collabora : 08-07-2015 at 08:46 AM.
 
 
 


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  Post #10 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 08:41 AM
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The "Unlimited" gimmick will never ever go away, same with SEO hosting.
 
 
 


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  Post #11 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collabora View Post
Read my post above (and a computer book). Its explained there. Maybe that's why you didn't quote the sentence above the one you did -- you don't want people to see it and how silly you are being

Disk space in a hosting plan refers to the quota configured by the provider (via control panel or native tools) in the OS, not the size of a physical drive. You really need to get outside your control panel and look at the OS
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You mentioned the 4GB thumb drive, which it has a 4GB limited . i asked you

Quote:
explain how i can get 1000+ GB on on 4GB thumb drive
you cant as it has a LIMIT of 4GB
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  Post #12 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by easyhostmedia View Post
You mentioned the 4GB thumb drive, which it has a 4GB limited . i asked you



you cant as it has a LIMIT of 4GB
Its explained in the post, that's why you only quote the conclusion and not the explanation that comes before it. Here is what you don't want your readers to see. I requote my own post:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Collabora View Post
....the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited. You can have unlimited disk space just as easily on a 4 GB thumb drive as on a 40 TB NAS
Again, don't believe me, look at what the OS reports when you don't allocate quota. But you will have to learn how to view server properties without a control panel.

I'd refer you to some good server management books on Amazon that explains it in more detail, but we have to get your reading comprehension skills up a bit first.

I won't mention your hypocrisy of offering unlimited hosting yourself. The difference between you and I is: I do it knowing how it works and that its real, you offer it believing its a lie.
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Last edited by Collabora : 08-07-2015 at 09:40 AM.
 
 
 


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  Post #13 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collabora View Post
I'd refer you to some good server management books on Amazon that explains it in more detail, but we have to get your reading comprehension skills up a bit first.
First and foremost, lets not be childish and result to insulting each other.
If you don't agree with someone's opinions, you're welcome to disagree or take your toys and go to your own sandbox, but there's is no reason to be childish.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Collabora View Post
First, the term "unlimited", in the context of shared hosting, refers to the quota allocations (for example, X GB of disk space) created by the provider and displayed in the hosting plan; it does not refer to the physical hardware. If the provider does not impose a limit, it is unlimited.
"Unlimited" is defined as "not limited; unrestricted; unconfined"
No matter how you spin it, all plans have limits, and therefore are not unlimited!

It may be a limit to the amount of space, the amount of IOPS, content, etc. There are many ways to limit a hosting plan besides a disk space quota allocation.

As to your argument that the physical hardware is irrelevant, let me ask you, can I host a single website on your shared account, and use 10TB of space?
If it's low traffic, it won't hit your IOPS/RAM/CPU limit.
If all files are available to the public, it won't violate your no file sharing policy.
If none of it is copyrighted, warez, porn, etc it wouldn't violate your fair use policy.

(although all of the limits above, are in fact limits, therefore it couldn't be unlimited if any of those are enforced)

So, would you allow this?
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  Post #14 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 10:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RDOServers View Post
First and foremost, lets not be childish and result to insulting each other.
If you don't agree with someone's opinions, you're welcome to disagree or take your toys and go to your own sandbox, but there's is no reason to be childish.
Its not a matter of opinion, its a matter of facts. There is some history here. I've explained the factual concept and factual differences of quota allocations versus hardware capacity to this person on several occasions. He never refutes the explanation, he just proceeds as if there were no explanations ever given.

I'll get to your technical questions in another reply

Last edited by Collabora : 08-07-2015 at 10:27 AM.
 
 
 


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  Post #15 (permalink)   08-07-2015, 06:17 PM
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As promised....

Quote:
Originally Posted by RDOServers View Post
"Unlimited" is defined as "not limited; unrestricted; unconfined"
No matter how you spin it, all plans have limits, and therefore are not unlimited!
Your dfinition is appropriate. However, your complete statement is a logical fallacy within a logical fallacy. Even though your statement is a non-sequiter and assumes the very thing you are trying to prove, I will attempt a reasoned response.

What you have not defined here is the concept of a (shared web) Hosting Plan. My working definition is: A "Hosting Plan" is a basket of Hosting Resources available for rent. These are typically listed on the host's web site as hosting plan boxes. For the "Limited Host" each resource listed is limited by a quota; that quota, or limit, is determined by the host and displayed in the hosting plan.

The "Unlimited Host" uses your primary definition of "unlimited" as being "not limited," a you described it. And recall from above, the thing that is doing the limiting in the first place is the host/provider through the use of quotas. Thus if the host/provider does not utilize a quota then we say that the "stuff" of the quota is not limited, and use the term "unlimited" in the hosting plan to mean just that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by RDOServers View Post
It may be a limit to the amount of space, the amount of IOPS, content, etc. There are many ways to limit a hosting plan besides a disk space quota allocation.
While that may be true in the general sense, that is not what is occuring. Hosting plans, by definition, don't include things like %CPU or GB RAM (ok, vps plans do, but not shared web hosting plans). No unlimited host is referring to cpu, ram, inodes, etc in their hosting plans -- and neither is the limited host. You are equating the TOS with the hosting plan. Both limited and unlimited hosts use similar TOS. A 500 mb wordpress site with a bad plugin can be denied a 3 GB plan -- but that does not mean there is no such thing as a 3 GB plan

To summarize this point - The difference between a limited host and an unlimited host is: the limited host uses the TOS and hosting plan to define limits, while the unlimited host just uses the TOS, and not the HOSTING PLAN.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RDOServers View Post
As to your argument that the physical hardware is irrelevant, let me ask you, can I host a single website on your shared account, and use 10TB of space?
If it's low traffic, it won't hit your IOPS/RAM/CPU limit.
If all files are available to the public, it won't violate your no file sharing policy.
If none of it is copyrighted, warez, porn, etc it wouldn't violate your fair use policy.

(although all of the limits above, are in fact limits, therefore it couldn't be unlimited if any of those are enforced)

So, would you allow this?
Under the terms you listed, yes. However, your list is incomplete. My terms also include 100% linkage and that the primary purpose of the "site" is not to use disk space or bw.

Given my experience, and probably the experience of every single host out there, there is no such thing as a 10 TB web site that meets those conditions making it suitable for a shared hosting environment.

Such questions are silly really. Its like saying you can't offer unlimited control panel licenses. Why? Because you can't deliver on a 10 trillion license order. Such is is the logic of the anti-unlimited crowd.

I'll leave you with this. Behold! Here is what unlimited disk space looks like on a Linux server (the names were changed to protect the guilty). 0 = No Limit = Unlimited:

PHP Code:
# repquota /home
*** Report for user quotas on device /dev/sda3
Block grace time
7daysInode grace time7days
                        Block limits                File limits
User            used    soft    hard  grace    used  soft  hard  grace
----------------------------------------------------------------------
root    --  566488       0       0           5401     0     0
RDOS    
--    1448       0       0             30     0     0
NiceD   
-- 1419352       0       0           1686     0     0
Art     
--   26604       0       0            172     0     0 
Who here is going to try and convince us that the OS is lying? Perhaps along with the outrageous scnearios like 10 TB sites suitable for shared hosting environment, someone will invent a CLI argument #there is no such thing as \unlimited"

So many hosts here puff their chests and claim "there is no such thing as unlimited" but have no qualms about offering unlimited email, unlimited databases, unlimited domains, etc. This is nothing but hypocrisy and ignorance -- or FUD marketing. Now they try to disguise it as "unmetered" lest they reveal their hypocrisy. Don't they know there is no such thing as unmetered hard drives? There is not even any such thing as a metered one!
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Last edited by Collabora : 08-07-2015 at 06:46 PM.
 
 
 
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